New all-motor AM/X class at MIRock-Prelim Rules

[Profile]

And aftermarket blocks, how much is a new factory block and you got to have it bored and plated.

[Cycle Concepts]

This post is directed towards Phil!!!!!! I'm going to say something that I think some want to say but won't. You know I can't keep my mouth shut. Richard started working on this class from the beginning of this year. Now you come and just took over and completely changed around everything he did his research on. This is not going to be a fun or somewhat affordable class for anyone with the rules I can see you implementing. I don't think most people really understand what's going to have to be done to run your rules. I will just sit back and watch and see what happens. But I don't believe that many people are going to try to run this class. Most of the people that come on here is not going to run the class. You know some people like to just talk, but don't take any actions. I think the real racers that would run the class would agree with Rich's rules. You might have some that try at first, because they want to try to do it themselves, but when they realize they cant keep up with the front runners, ( the bigger name builders that will figure out what weight wiil work best) they won't last too long. So good luck with that.

Eric, you are talking out the side of your neck about Phil and him taking over anything to do with this class..First off, there was discussion 6months ago about bringing a no bar all motor class with very similar rules to the AMA/Dragbike "Superbike" class with the "folks" of MIRock..It was given the preliminary name of All Motor Extreme(AM/X)...This is a mere coincidence that there are two similar sets of rules being discussed at the same time...I don't know all the details of where and how Rich's class will be run but I do know what MIROck will require for it to be run at MIRock as one of their classes...Everything ain't always what it seems, so be careful how you come at people on certain matters...

[Cycle Concepts]

I don't think Phill will have no problem checking bikesbut you better be ready when it's time for a check up

That's if he's even gonna be the one checking them!!

[Profile]

That's if he's even gonna be the one checking them!!

Well I hope so he does a pretty good job

[richard gadson]

i just want a class to materialize. i dont want the topic to become counter productive and then jason just scratches the whole deal. whatever the rules end up being, i just hope a lot of people support it. we need something new! something unique. phil and i are talking now about middle ground and whats BEST for the class to take off and stay for a while. the rules will be FINALIZED next week and posted

[MIRock Technical Staff]

i just want a class to materialize. i dont want the topic to become counter productive and then jason just scratches the whole deal. whatever the rules end up being, i just hope a lot of people support it. we need something new! something unique. phil and i are talking now about middle ground and whats BEST for the class to take off and stay for a while. the rules will be FINALIZED next week and posted

Just to clarify this, what Richard means is that we will have a finalized proposal to give to MIRock next week. We are going to finish it together taking into consideration everyone's concerns expressed both here and by direct communication with many of you. We will also post the proposal on Psychobike for everyone to see, that way they have at least a good idea what the rules will be, and can start moving forward with builds. The proposal may not have every detail about every item on the bike, but all major points of concern such as displacement, weight, electronics, engine materials, etc. will be finalized.

On the MIRock side, the actual finalized rulebook will take a while to put together. We won't even begin writing it until Jason, Steve, and Royce approve moving forward with the class. It will then need to go back and forth between us several times for proofreading and to tweak all of the wording. This process takes a while, especially with the Holiday season coming up. So I wouldn't expect to see a complete, detailed rulebook until probably January (that is assuming MIRock agrees to take it on). And before anyone asks, I have no idea what the schedule will be, or when the first race will be. I can't even guarantee that MIRock will take on this class. So please direct any such questions to one of the three I mentioned above, they are the only ones that have any say-so on the matter.

[MIRock Technical Staff]

This post is directed towards Phil!!!!!! I'm going to say something that I think some want to say but won't. You know I can't keep my mouth shut. Richard started working on this class from the beginning of this year. Now you come and just took over and completely changed around everything he did his research on. This is not going to be a fun or somewhat affordable class for anyone with the rules I can see you implementing. I don't think most people really understand what's going to have to be done to run your rules. I will just sit back and watch and see what happens. But I don't believe that many people are going to try to run this class. Most of the people that come on here is not going to run the class. You know some people like to just talk, but don't take any actions. I think the real racers that would run the class would agree with Rich's rules. You might have some that try at first, because they want to try to do it themselves, but when they realize they cant keep up with the front runners, ( the bigger name builders that will figure out what weight wiil work best) they won't last too long. So good luck with that.

BNL, I have said this to you before and I will say it again: If you actually knew 10% of what you think you know, you would be dangerous.

Up to this point, I have intentionally made a point to not respond to any of your comments, a practice I plan to resume immediately after this post. I learned a long time ago not to expend any energy engaging with you in discussions because it is pointless. My efforts would be better spent trying to raise coconut trees in Alaska. But I am going to make one comment on this just because your facts are so grossly incorrect, and the truth needs to be clarified.

For starters, Richard came to MIRock about this class and asked us to work out a set of rules, not the other way around. And this didn't just happen last week. MIRock has been discussing the addition of a new no-bar class for a couple of years now. Jason first discussed Richards specific request and proposals with me early in the season, at a MIR event. In May.

Shortly after that, I wrote out a basic overview of 2 different classes for everyone to see and consider, with the rules I have posted here being one of them (including the AM/X name). I sent an email copy to Jason and handed out paper copies of the rules for both classes to Steve Earwood, Doug Ray, and Tim Hailey in the tower at Rockingham. In June.

Nothing further was done at the time because MIRock was not sure what was going to happen after the 2012 season. Pro Mod was in flux, some of the sponsors were in question, and obviously the addition of a new track was under consideration. So MIRock chose to sit back and wait on the ideas of any new classes until after the season. Now I know that you were not aware of any of this (which goes back the whole 10% thing), but things would really work a lot more smoothly if you tried to find out all of the actual facts before making outlandish claims about events for which you were not present nor even aware. If you were really looking to know the truth before talking, you should have just called me. I would have given you the correct information, including that about events for which you clearly had no idea even took place.

[CompetitionCNC]

A power commander and an Lm-2 is about $700 Whats a motec cost?

Billet cranks can be made lighter as are TI rods. They allow the engine to spin up quicker and accelerate the bike faster down the track.

Theres no reason why these engines, with weld-up cranks and steel rods, cant run all season without a teardown.

A bore scope can easily go in threw the clutch cover and look at all the rod beams and at the crank and pistons.

If the rules on the head, valves, cams etc are open then theres no need to even pull the cam cover on the engine for tech.

There could be a limit to the boring of the oem throttle bodies to 46 mm. This way the gen 1 busas cant be bored and the zx14 and gen 2 busas can be bored 2 mm to 46 mm.......

$3000+ motec vs $700 powercommander and LM-2
$3000+ billet crank vs weldup $1100
$1600 cylinder block vs $450 bore and replate
$3500 carbs or EFI vs $700 bored oem
$2000 TI rods VS $600 - $1000
$4000 Carbon wheels vs oem

I'm good whatever the rules end up being. And I'll adjust to them so its not a big deal for me but im just thinking of the bulk of the racers out there.

[money maker]

A power commander and an Lm-2 is about $700 Whats a motec cost?

Billet cranks can be made lighter as are TI rods. They allow the engine to spin up quicker and accelerate the bike faster down the track.

Theres no reason why these engines, with weld-up cranks and steel rods, cant run all season without a teardown.

A bore scope can easily go in threw the clutch cover and look at all the rod beams and at the crank and pistons.

If the rules on the head, valves, cams etc are open then theres no need to even pull the cam cover on the engine for tech.

There could be a limit to the boring of the oem throttle bodies to 46 mm. This way the gen 1 busas cant be bored and the zx14 and gen 2 busas can be bored 2 mm to 46 mm.......

$3000+ motec vs $700 powercommander and LM-2
$3000+ billet crank vs weldup $1100
$1600 cylinder block vs $450 bore and replate
$3500 carbs or EFI vs $700 bored oem
$2000 TI rods VS $600 - $1000
$4000 Carbon wheels vs oem

I'm good whatever the rules end up being. And I'll adjust to them so its not a big deal for me but im just thinking of the bulk of the racers out there.

if you need a oem block thats $1000 plus bore and replate $500. brand new mps billet block $1350 ready to go. thats just another way to look at it. new vs new billet is cheaper

[BROTHER-N-LAW]

Eric, you are talking out the side of your neck about Phil and him taking over anything to do with this class..First off, there was discussion 6months ago about bringing a no bar all motor class with very similar rules to the AMA/Dragbike "Superbike" class with the "folks" of MIRock..It was given the preliminary name of All Motor Extreme(AM/X)...This is a mere coincidence that there are two similar sets of rules being discussed at the same time...I don't know all the details of where and how Rich's class will be run but I do know what MIROck will require for it to be run at MIRock as one of their classes...Everything ain't always what it seems, so be careful how you come at people on certain matters...

First of all, I never did get what that means, talking out the side of your neck!! Second of all, Rich has been talking about this class all year. Not for 6 months.You say mere coincidence, but if seems kind of funny to me and some others. And last, what do you mean by "so be careful how you come at people on certain matters"?

[show2ime]

if you need a oem block thats $1000 plus bore and replate $500. brand new mps billet block $1350 ready to go. thats just another way to look at it. new vs new billet is cheaper

And as we have said 100 times its more reliable and no perf gain

[BROTHER-N-LAW]

BNL, I have said this to you before and I will say it again: If you actually knew 10% of what you think you know, you would be dangerous.

Up to this point, I have intentionally made a point to not respond to any of your comments, a practice I plan to resume immediately after this post. I learned a long time ago not to expend any energy engaging with you in discussions because it is pointless. My efforts would be better spent trying to raise coconut trees in Alaska. But I am going to make one comment on this just because your facts are so grossly incorrect, and the truth needs to be clarified.

For starters, Richard came to MIRock about this class and asked us to work out a set of rules, not the other way around. And this didn't just happen last week. MIRock has been discussing the addition of a new no-bar class for a couple of years now. Jason first discussed Richards specific request and proposals with me early in the season, at a MIR event. In May.

Shortly after that, I wrote out a basic overview of 2 different classes for everyone to see and consider, with the rules I have posted here being one of them (including the AM/X name). I sent an email copy to Jason and handed out paper copies of the rules for both classes to Steve Earwood, Doug Ray, and Tim Hailey in the tower at Rockingham. In June.

Nothing further was done at the time because MIRock was not sure what was going to happen after the 2012 season. Pro Mod was in flux, some of the sponsors were in question, and obviously the addition of a new track was under consideration. So MIRock chose to sit back and wait on the ideas of any new classes until after the season. Now I know that you were not aware of any of this (which goes back the whole 10% thing), but things would really work a lot more smoothly if you tried to find out all of the actual facts before making outlandish claims about events for which you were not present nor even aware. If you were really looking to know the truth before talking, you should have just called me. I would have given you the correct information, including that about events for which you clearly had no idea even took place.

Phil, I alway knew you didn't like me before you even met me. (Things that we being said on PB.) That doesn't matter to me. Just to keep this short, I KNOW MORE THAN YOU THINK I KNOW!!!!! I usually keep my mouth shut, till I feel it's time open it!!!

[Profile]

I think they should allow after market ECU cause you will have to tune it just like a piggyback system. After market blocks cause what happen if something went wrong and I have to buy a new OEM block and get it bored and plated .
Ti rods allow them to why not cause they are little lighter what about aluminum rods they are lite too.
And bikes come stock with Ti valves SMH ...

[Cycle Concepts]

First of all, I never did get what that means, talking out the side of your neck!! Second of all, Rich has been talking about this class all year. Not for 6 months.You say mere coincidence, but if seems kind of funny to me and some others. And last, what do you mean by "so be careful how you come at people on certain matters"?

You simply spit stuff out your mouth that you know nothing about..Especially on this matter!!!!

[Profile]

And thing about billet cranks been lite but weldup cranks can be lighten up a bit too