New all-motor AM/X class at MIRock-Prelim Rules

[rcrecovery]

mirock dude you got a heck of a job . i guess whenever you guys come to a conclusion on these we will just have to adapt to what you guys come up with.

[airtime loc]

Cant see this working out to well for the tech guy

[popeye]

I got a 99 Busa that's been out in my garage for 8years now crying to get out. My stroker motor is still under my work bench. I got some work to do if someone pulls the trigger on this thing. I'm 240 now. I can get to maybe 210 -220 suited if the rules work to help a bigger guy out.

You guys need to gear the rider weight closer to 180-190 suited for any big guy to have a fighting chance. But I think tracks would rather see fast bikes than full fields....

[richard gadson]

-phil, why ban blocks if there is such a wide range of bore and it has to be policed?? i had no billet blocks in my set of rules to police bore in a simple way. but at this point, its pointless to prohibit an aftermarket block. besides, what about the heavier people who will fall in the higher weight brackets?? he may want/need a bigger bore than an 85mm. but there is no performance gain in having an 84mm stock block vs an 84mm aftermarket block. people keep talking about cost, but if you dont want or need an aftermarket block, DONT BUY ONE!!! doesnt matter what everybody else has

-as far as billet cranks, they need to be allowed. PERIOD

-i can live with no ti rods as a rule

-no auto's is a good one too

-i vote for 2" ground clearance. i challenge ANYONE to tell me when they have ever seen anyone bust a flat oil pan in with atleast 2" of ground clearance in ANY CLASS!! street bikes with stock pans are the ones who break pans. the do not get checked for ground clearance, and WE DO!! but we get penalized for what the street bikes do. besides, many people have a 2" billet oil pan, or a murray pipe. if 3" is the rule, some of those bikes will be high and will be forced to buy the 1" pans raised up pipes, etc. i think the more "outlaw" or "mean" stance and look these bikes have, the better for appeal

-as far as standalones...... i say NO!!! phil you keep talking about the fact that they arent much more than stock ecu's and all the electronics you have to put on them. i agree that an ENTRY LEVEL standalone is not much more expensive. but a Motec M800 & harness IS!! and if standalone is allowed, so is the M800 or whatever other ECU that has high cost. so if standalone is allowed and can be done so cheap. put a PRICE CAP on what can be used. but people will find ways around that im sure. but power commanders, bazazz, flashed ecu's, and sb6's work just fine in my opinion. and average joes can work them. standalones will make people dependant on people. remember pro street back when mirelli's first came out? i personally like the standalones and the idea and capabilities of them, but im thinking of the whole class and general public

-as far as the capabilities of a gen 2 busas ecu...... do these advantages show ON THE TRACK??? i ride them, zx14's, 1000's, etc and i have not seen these advantages on my time slips. i do not agree that its an unfair advantage. and besides, thats the beauty of picking your bike!! i will be riding a gen 1 busa and HAVE NO FEAR OF A GEN2 and its ECU editor flashing capabilities

-no carbs or aftermarket throttle bodies. why?? be CONSISTENT!! if we are keeping cost down the best we can, lets keep the cost down the best we can! if $2500 ti rods are expensive and therefore prohibited, so should a set of $2500 lectrons, or $3500 injectrons, or whatever else. and carbs call for an aftermarket ignition(mc4, pro series, firestorm, etc) with the cheapest one being an additional $800. if carbs are allowed, I WILL HAVE THEM!! but like i said, lets be consistent. OEM is simple and cheap. it already comes on the bike!!

-wheels?? come on guys. its a pro category. we should be allowed to buy whatever wheels we choose. bst's, marvics, etc have been around a long time. lets keep them around. some of you guys with the smaller cc engines who are allowed to be a lightweight package will need bst's or marvics(or any magnesium wheels). i will have forged aluminum wheels on the bike im riding because i need to make 600 lbs.

but as i read these posts, i see a lot of people worrying about what the NEXT MAN will have or be doing. when the rules are finalized, if billet blocks are allowed, WHO CARES?? there is no illegal bore size, so whats the point?? think of the big picture and the whole class, not just YOURSELF because you dont want or cant afford a block. it doesnt mean the next man will win! but you will hurt the big guys. aside from the ti rods, all other engine components should be allowed. a gen 2 busa comes with ti-valves, so allow them to everybody, which is the same reason standalones are being considered. remember consistency?? but i see a lot of personal agendas. which is cool, but dont be biased. i want ti rods, but i can see the reason for not having them. thats UNBIASED!

ultimately i want to see a class come from all this. we can go back and forth forever. but its going to take some compromise and sacrifice. we all have different ways to skin the same cat. but we have the opportunity to have an ALL MOTOR class. lets make it fair, as affordable as possible, as simple as possible(if simplicity works best), and have some FUN!!!

[STREETDRAG]

All Motor will make it so the backyard mechanic can showcase his raw skills too. I like that just in itself...All NUTS, BIG BOY SHIT....

-phil, why ban blocks if there is such a wide range of bore and it has to be policed?? i had no billet blocks in my set of rules to police bore in a simple way. but at this point, its pointless to prohibit an aftermarket block. besides, what about the heavier people who will fall in the higher weight brackets?? he may want/need a bigger bore than an 85mm. but there is no performance gain in having an 84mm stock block vs an 84mm aftermarket block. people keep talking about cost, but if you dont want or need an aftermarket block, DONT BUY ONE!!! doesnt matter what everybody else has

-as far as billet cranks, they need to be allowed. PERIOD

-i can live with no ti rods as a rule

-no auto's is a good one too

-i vote for 2" ground clearance. i challenge ANYONE to tell me when they have ever seen anyone bust a flat oil pan in with atleast 2" of ground clearance in ANY CLASS!! street bikes with stock pans are the ones who break pans. the do not get checked for ground clearance, and WE DO!! but we get penalized for what the street bikes do. besides, many people have a 2" billet oil pan, or a murray pipe. if 3" is the rule, some of those bikes will be high and will be forced to buy the 1" pans raised up pipes, etc. i think the more "outlaw" or "mean" stance and look these bikes have, the better for appeal

-as far as standalones...... i say NO!!! phil you keep talking about the fact that they arent much more than stock ecu's and all the electronics you have to put on them. i agree that an ENTRY LEVEL standalone is not much more expensive. but a Motec M800 & harness IS!! and if standalone is allowed, so is the M800 or whatever other ECU that has high cost. so if standalone is allowed and can be done so cheap. put a PRICE CAP on what can be used. but people will find ways around that im sure. but power commanders, bazazz, flashed ecu's, and sb6's work just fine in my opinion. and average joes can work them. standalones will make people dependant on people. remember pro street back when mirelli's first came out? i personally like the standalones and the idea and capabilities of them, but im thinking of the whole class and general public

-as far as the capabilities of a gen 2 busas ecu...... do these advantages show ON THE TRACK??? i ride them, zx14's, 1000's, etc and i have not seen these advantages on my time slips. i do not agree that its an unfair advantage. and besides, thats the beauty of picking your bike!! i will be riding a gen 1 busa and HAVE NO FEAR OF A GEN2 and its ECU editor flashing capabilities

-no carbs or aftermarket throttle bodies. why?? be CONSISTENT!! if we are keeping cost down the best we can, lets keep the cost down the best we can! if $2500 ti rods are expensive and therefore prohibited, so should a set of $2500 lectrons, or $3500 injectrons, or whatever else. and carbs call for an aftermarket ignition(mc4, pro series, firestorm, etc) with the cheapest one being an additional $800. if carbs are allowed, I WILL HAVE THEM!! but like i said, lets be consistent. OEM is simple and cheap. it already comes on the bike!!

-wheels?? come on guys. its a pro category. we should be allowed to buy whatever wheels we choose. bst's, marvics, etc have been around a long time. lets keep them around. some of you guys with the smaller cc engines who are allowed to be a lightweight package will need bst's or marvics(or any magnesium wheels). i will have forged aluminum wheels on the bike im riding because i need to make 600 lbs.

but as i read these posts, i see a lot of people worrying about what the NEXT MAN will have or be doing. when the rules are finalized, if billet blocks are allowed, WHO CARES?? there is no illegal bore size, so whats the point?? think of the big picture and the whole class, not just YOURSELF because you dont want or cant afford a block. it doesnt mean the next man will win! but you will hurt the big guys. aside from the ti rods, all other engine components should be allowed. a gen 2 busa comes with ti-valves, so allow them to everybody, which is the same reason standalones are being considered. remember consistency?? but i see a lot of personal agendas. which is cool, but dont be biased. i want ti rods, but i can see the reason for not having them. thats UNBIASED!

ultimately i want to see a class come from all this. we can go back and forth forever. but its going to take some compromise and sacrifice. we all have different ways to skin the same cat. but we have the opportunity to have an ALL MOTOR class. lets make it fair, as affordable as possible, as simple as possible(if simplicity works best), and have some FUN!!!

[BRAVO]

1) 2" Ground clearance..........don't see it......(too many people will start crying.)

2) Billet cranks...........ALLOW.....................(bigboi's gonna need them!)

3) Ti rod....................ALLOW.....................(All this talk about keeping cost down,I understand BUT If you and I both have 6.25 cranks/with the same rods & I decide to spend 2500 on ti rods how does that affect anybody else but me?? I doubt I'm gonna run over everybody in the class because I have ti rods in my motor? And lets be real when it comes down to it you don't need them BUT a big guy using a BIG crank reliability would be better off using ti rods.

4) 2.62 Rule.....at 620lbs how do you build a 1624?......I like Rich CC rule better.

5) NO AUTO's...............I can see that.

6) NO light weight wheels.........lol... Ridiculousness. You can run them in street et but not in ALL MOTOR EXTREME. funny!


7) Carbs.....ALLOW....why not? And please don't say to keep the cost down in the class. Your not required to have them!... Let the old gs boys play.

8) Billet blocks.....I wouldn't care. Although it would be easier to police bore if not allow. OR only allow them if your total package is over a certain weight.

9) Front/rear brakes.......???..... A LOT of these bikes have drag pegs from 3" to 10" back. So since you CAN run only one rotor on the front,why not allow people the option to run two rotors up front and no rear brake. But the rule may me some type of insurance issue.

10) Standalones.......HELL NO.....THE NEW MOTEC IS A BADD MUTHERPUCKER!!!!!! If you put one in the right hands,I promise they gonna run away with the class!

But I wish this class the best of luck,and can't wait to you fellas get down!

[ptp20067]

Budget class?????? Anything capable of producing 7.70s is not gonna be done on a budget. A new class is exciting to think about,but stop coming out and saying budget this and budget that!:mad:

2

[richard gadson]

Budget class?????? Anything capable of producing 7.70s is not gonna be done on a budget. A new class is exciting to think about,but stop coming out and saying budget this and budget that!:mad:

2

you say that because of YOUR budget. but to a man who wants to race a pro class and knows how expensive that can be, it is a cheaper class. you are not seeing the significant costs cut from either a ALL OUT all motor bike, or other pro classes such as pro street or pro mod. it just depends on what u feel is the definition of "budget". but no, its not street et type cheap

[CAPO SUPREM]

All motor class will be good..Make the rules simple because no Disrespect but unless the tech is going to be tight like Nhra prostock 90% wont be checked anyway! Phill has way to many classes to tech! Its so many angles guys can get away with cheating..If you shift your bike with Nos you can also use it as a dry shot ect..Who will check all this type of stuff??? And no billet cranks and ti rods??? Who will be willing to tear down a motor for a light purse?? Class would be nice to see but tech will have to be tight or rules will have to be very simple..

[BROTHER-N-LAW]

This post is directed towards Phil!!!!!! I'm going to say something that I think some want to say but won't. You know I can't keep my mouth shut. Richard started working on this class from the beginning of this year. Now you come and just took over and completely changed around everything he did his research on. This is not going to be a fun or somewhat affordable class for anyone with the rules I can see you implementing. I don't think most people really understand what's going to have to be done to run your rules. I will just sit back and watch and see what happens. But I don't believe that many people are going to try to run this class. Most of the people that come on here is not going to run the class. You know some people like to just talk, but don't take any actions. I think the real racers that would run the class would agree with Rich's rules. You might have some that try at first, because they want to try to do it themselves, but when they realize they cant keep up with the front runners, ( the bigger name builders that will figure out what weight wiil work best) they won't last too long. So good luck with that.

[show2ime]

Also the rules need to be out quickly. People have bikes sitting and march will be here before you can blink

[money maker]

Also the rules need to be out quickly. People have bikes sitting and march will be here before you can blink

Thats the truth. If u need a crank Marine is 6 weeks behind then u still have shipping

2

[Profile]

I don't think Phill will have no problem checking bikesbut you better be ready when it's time for a check up

[Profile]

I keep hearing that stand alones will be a problem with the right man gets behind them so what's is the difference when the right man gets behind a power commander are ECU Editor SMH

[Profile]

And aftermarket blocks, how much is a new factory block and you got to have it bored and plated.